227. The New Rules of Engagement For Coworking Spaces - What you Sell

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227. The New Rules of Engagement For Coworking Spaces - What you Sell

00:00:01 Welcome to the everything coworking podcast, where you learn what you need to know about how the world wants to work. And now your host coworking space owner and trend expert, Jamie Russo. Welcome to the everything co-working podcast. This is your host, Jamie Russo. So last week on the podcast, we introduced the new rules of engagement for coworking spaces. And I shared some of the big buckets of ways in which we are looking at our business and questioning everything.

00:00:48 So one of those buckets was what you sell or your product mix, or however you want to refer to that. So we introduced that as kind of a high level in last episode. So I thought on this episode, I would take a little bit of a deep dive into what that looks like, what some operators are experimenting with and finding success with,

00:01:09 to give you kind of some things to specific things to think about that you might implement into your business. So we're going to talk about a few kind of themes, flexibility, privacy, the HQ model, which I introduced last week and realized you may not be very familiar with what that was. I wasn't until I worked on the broker course with Kane Welmont and then other models that are becoming popular and other sources of revenue.

00:01:37 And these are all examples of things that I hear from talking to operators every month in our flight group program, in our community manager university in our startup school. So let's talk about flexibility. So I think we've always been about flexibility, but COVID-19 has really accelerated or need to respond to market demand differently because that demand has shifted a bit. So one aspect of this is the full time commitment.

00:02:13 So I used to talk a lot about just make everybody be a full-time member, right? They they're paying for access. You can't pay for part-time access to your local gym. You need to be an actual member. The challenge I think we're seeing is that there are a lot of folks out there who are interested in coworking and are trying to figure out what the new normal looks like.

00:02:36 How often are they going to be in an office? How often are they going to be at home? And they simply can't in their mind envision getting close to full-time use of a coworking space. They're balancing too many different sort of needs and requirements on how they spend their day. So sometimes it can be at home. Sometimes they can be in the coworking space.

00:02:59 Sometimes they might be need to be, if they're an employee or an employee of a company, they may need to be somewhere else. So, or in meetings or, you know, all the things we all do so many different things of the day. And I am still a huge proponent of being careful about how we offer ultimate flexibility because we have to make the model work,

00:03:20 right? So we know that we have to sell a lot more part-time memberships in order to generate revenue that is equivalent to full-time memberships. And we know that requires a customer acquisition machine that brings a lots of potential members in the door that we can close, even if it's on a super flexible program. So you will need to give more tours and close more tours to generate revenue that is close to full-time revenue.

00:03:53 But if that's the demand that you're seeing come through the door and you feel like you just have to address it. And that's where your revenue is going to come from is folks that are not full-timers. Then it's something to consider, but still be careful. You don't want three options for part-time programs. You don't want an option for everybody that walks through the door.

00:04:15 So we want to be careful. Again, we want to be intentional and thoughtful about serving our members, but also making sure that our model works and we can stay in business. So I talk about this with my members all the time. One of my members recently said, you know, I just feel like everybody wants something slightly different. Some people want five days.

00:04:34 Some people want seven days. Some people want eight days. Some people want 10 days. I think it's not in your best interest to serve at that level of granularity, right? Because that jacks up the admin time, that it takes you to manage plans in your system. You've got different people on different plans and you're not following any sort of 80 20 rules.

00:04:55 So we probably don't want a custom plan for everybody that walks into the space. We want to figure out what works for most people. And then we want to charge a premium for that flexibility. Because again, if you, there are other membership models, and if you join on anything less than a year or a longer term commitment, you're paying more for that ability.

00:05:18 So, especially for folks who remember you are the one signing the long-term lease. You are the one putting down the security or the personal guarantee potential and a security deposit and all the expenses that it takes to get into the space. And you are committed for the longterm. And you need some form of commitment from your membership in order to make this model work and make sure you have enough recurring revenue.

00:05:43 Although I know I have some folks in my group were running on a non recurring revenue model. So we'll see how that experiment goes, but you need you, most of you seek the security of recurring revenue. So that is the other aspect I would make sure you're thinking about if you offer flexibility, make sure it's on a recurring model where possible, so you could do a punch card and you have to figure out how to track these things.

00:06:12 I'm not sure I would get overly caught up in tracking. I really think if your system doesn't track really well, when someone walks in the door, I would use sort of that 80 20 rule again and assume most people are going to track. So a couple of episodes ago, I talked about my experience joining a coworking space. They never told me that I have to book a spot.

00:06:31 When I come in there, wasn't in the onboarding materials, which I did read it wasn't anywhere. And so after I'd been in like five times, someone said, Hey, who are you? And we need you to book your slot when you come in. And I said, that's no problem. I can easily do that on their, you know,

00:06:48 space management app. But in my head, you know, I thought, well, I was already counting my, you know, I knew exactly how many days I had used for the month. I was absolutely never going to go over. I think most people are like that. They're not trying to break the system or take advantage of the system. So I would focus on recurring packages of flexibility.

00:07:15 So, you know, offer the day pass. But the day pass should really be it for really casual drop in people. If you can try to get folks into that five or 10 day, and if they're going five days, it should be at a premium 10 days at a premium. And that's at a premium to the daily rate. If they commit to full-time.

00:07:32 So take your full-time membership. It's $300 a month and there are 30 days in a month and it's 10 bucks a day. You should be charging more than $10 a day for those 10 day passes and five day passes. If that's what you're offering, they should be at a premium because it is a huge advantage for folks to only be able to use your space exactly when they want to and not pay for access.

00:07:54 So make sure that daily rate is higher. And the other thing I talk about this a lot, but for those who are newer listeners, there are only 20 working days in a month, ish, right? Some months have, you know, more days. But roughly if we have four weeks in a month, five working days in each week, that's 20 days.

00:08:15 So most people will want to come to your space half the time. So if you offer a 10 day pass, that's perfect for almost everyone. So you will probably cannibalize your full-time membership if you offer it. So you need to be prepared for that. People do that. Math they'll realize most people come in half. Most people come in a third of the time,

00:08:36 right? So if you give them that flexible option, that's what they're going to buy. So you have to bank on the fact that you're going to sell more of them. But again, we get it. People are now used to sort of balancing they've set up their home office. They're used to this hybrid home work or home coworking space, some other workspace,

00:08:55 but just be really intentional about what you're offering and don't overdo the offerings on your website. If you're going to customize things, do it in person. And I talked last time on the last episode about fueled collective, who's got this beautiful three step process on their website. Step one is take it to tour. Step two is personalize. Your membership. Step three is to join an onboard.

00:09:19 So they're not listing all the possible computations of a membership that they will offer you on their website. They're saying, look, here's roughly what we offer come in. And we're going to find a way to make it work for you. And they may not even do that forever. You know, they may go back to the 80 20 of, of like,

00:09:37 this is what most people need, and this is what we are selling, but for now they're being extra flexible. And so that's a big theme I see around what we're selling. I also wonder if we won't shift our models a little bit. I think about the gym analogy a lot. And I think about joining a gym, you don't join a gym for access to a treadmill or access to only the spin class,

00:10:00 right? You join the gym because you want access to whatever it is that you want to use in any given day. And in coworking, we tend to sell access to a particular aspect of the space. You join, you get access to a hot desk, you join, you get access to a dedicated desk. You join, you get your own office.

00:10:18 There's no mixing and matching. There's no like using what's useful to you for that day. And that is just not a super typical model elsewhere. So I think we'll start to see a little bit more of this idea of like, look, come in and use. What's useful to you. And we can figure out a way to charge you for that.

00:10:38 Again, I don't have a great example of folks that are doing this except the mixing and matching of the product. And I talked about this in the last episode a little bit. So this is both for individuals and corporate users. It can be really useful. So we recognize that some days you have heads down work to do. And some days you have 16 zoom calls and you,

00:11:02 if you have 16 zoom calls, you cannot do that in our open space. And you cannot do that in our phone room. So we need to give you a solution for that. Otherwise you're not coming in. And the mixing and matching works out really well because I think we have a budget resistance to committing to a full-time office. If that's not what we need most of the time,

00:11:23 if we only need that some of the time. And especially if we work for a corporate employer and we have to pay out of pocket, small business owners are used to paying for office space and meeting space and those things out of pocket, it's an expense they plan for, and it's not sort of painful to, to do it cause it's just, they,

00:11:41 they expect it. They feel like it's normal. Our corporate users probably don't yet feel like it's normal, that they now have to use their disposable income to pay, to leave the house to work. And if their not paying yet, then that is just it's, it's tricky. Right? So offering them the ability to get access to private space when they need it,

00:12:02 but try to keep their budget low, lower than having to commit to a full-time office may work for them. So we're seeing these mix and match like five, you know, co-working days and access to one day a week in an office for X amount. And so this requires you to set aside an office that has, you know, it's variable. So you will try to sell it,

00:12:26 you know, for more, you're trying to get more out of that office in terms of revenue and in terms of usability for your members. So I think one thing we want to think about is there is the, you know, sort of economic optimization and then there's out of a particular asset like an office, but then there's the overall membership optimization. So can you take an office out of the full-time commitment inventory and let it be variable so that you can sell more open space memberships?

00:12:58 So you have to kind of look at the numbers and experiment with that a little bit. Some folks are doing really well on both fronts. They're monetizing offices. I talk about the team, Dan and shell at the post. Often we have other members of our community who are doing the same thing. They're overselling those variable offices, and they're getting more than they would be if it was a fixed asset,

00:13:20 going to one member for the month. And it allows them to take on more members because those members are getting access to this shared office that fits their budget and meets their needs. So the shared private office, the coworking access plus bucket of office hours, the less than full-time commitment. And one other theme that I'm seeing is packages for quarterly off sites or monthly off sites or whatever that looks like,

00:13:48 and sort of configuring your space and framing the space so that people can see that this works really well for them. So I was, I'm going to mention the Healdsburg space. I mentioned last time and Jim and his team kind of organized the space so that they have this great boardroom, but really open space where you could put post-its on the notes and whatnot,

00:14:11 or on the walls, sorry, in the back of the space that leads to outdoor space. And it has access to the kitchen for coffee and catering and whatnot. It also is right next to another meeting room and has access for other kind of other flexible space. So basically you could sort of take the whole back of the space if you were coming in for an offsite and you could have some private space in meeting rooms,

00:14:38 you could have some brainstorming, like bigger boardroom type space can have access to the, to the kitchen space. And so you could get a lot done in that, like w Knuck and he can sort of package that and frame it as exactly what you need for your company's off sites, where you need creative time and you need, you know, kind of private meeting space.

00:14:58 So I think framing what you have in your space and how it fits the needs of our users is also a real opportunity. Hey, I just wanted to jump in really quickly before we continue with our discussion. If you're working on opening a co-working space, I want to invite you to join me for my free masterclass three behind the scenes secrets to opening a coworking space.

00:15:21 If you're working on opening a co-working space, I want to share the three decisions that I've seen successful operators make when they're creating their coworking business. The masterclass is totally free. It's about an hour and includes some Q and a. If you'd like to join me, you can register@everythingcoworking.com forward slash masterclass. If you already have a coworking space, I want to make sure you know,

00:15:45 about community manager, university, community manager, university is a training and development platform for community managers. And it can be for owner operators. It has content training resources, templates from day one to general manager. The platform includes many courses that cover the major buckets of the community manager role from community management, operations, sales, and marketing, finance, and leadership.

00:16:13 The content is laid out in a graduated learning path. So the community manager can identify what content is most relevant to them, depending on their experience and kind of jump in from there. We provide a live brand new training every single month for the community manager group. We also host a live Q and a call every single month so that the community managers can work through any challenges that they're having or opportunities get ideas from other community managers build their own peer network.

00:16:45 We also have a private slack group for the group. So if you're interested in learning more, you can go to everything, coworking.com forward slash community manager, and then this is related, but addressing needs for privacy. So the, a big complaint I continue to hear is how hard it is to sell open space. I think this has always been harder,

00:17:06 right? It's harder to sell open space depending on your community. And there are folks who sell open space really well. We had Tessa from the quench club on, and she has a lot of open space. She's just really unique community and has framed it as a work club and is drawing people in. And I had another member of my, one of my coworking groups that was working out of her space.

00:17:33 And she said the place was like jamming. There are tons of people in the open space. So there are examples of folks who are doing well with this. And it tends to be more, something more subjective that they're doing or framing or the strength of the community or something they've got going on there. But an easy fix to selling more open space is to have more phone rooms.

00:17:56 This sounds simple, but I know we're hesitant to make the investment in those sometimes. And I have other members of our flight group program who can literally see the switch flip. They put in the phone booth. And when they do tours, people see those phone boosts and are more likely to take a dedicated desk or a hot space because hot desk, because they know they have a place to go make those phone calls and or the zoom call.

00:18:19 And it's super important. We have to have access to those and they have to be usable. I mentioned a couple of episodes ago. The place that I joined the phone room is not usable in my opinion, because this is super, super simple, but the table is much lower than the seat. And so I have to look down and I looked not great when I looked down into a camera,

00:18:42 right? It's not a good angle and it's uncomfortable. It hurts my back. So I can't sit there for very long. And I know they don't want you to sit there for very long, but on the other hand, this is what people need, right? So some of my members are changing their phone booth limitations to two hours instead of one hours,

00:18:59 one hour. And so we have this, you know, this mindset of don't let people stay in the phone booth too long, make it uncomfortable. Well, do you want it to be usable? Or, you know, we, I get it. We don't want somebody to park in there for four hours a day, but we want people to be able to join and use our hot desk memberships.

00:19:18 And I always remind folks, you have to have a very specific role in your work life to not need to take phone calls or zoom calls. And that's a small segment of people, right? That don't need to be recording like I'm doing now or on a client call or on some sort of zoom call. And I've seen I'll use Jim's example again,

00:19:37 because I just happened to be there. People were taking zoom calls out in the open because I don't think he had the white noise, the space that I joined has the white noise. And so I think I could do certain types of calls in the open space, but I'm not going to take like one-on-one mentorship calls in the open space. I feel like that's not appropriate.

00:19:56 Most people are not going to do that. But if you have a quick check in with a team member or whatever, if your space, you know, sort of supports it, sometimes you can, but in general, it's not usually super comfortable. And so you want to have phone rooms and those can make a big difference if you have a lot of open space,

00:20:15 because if you don't have privacy, it's expensive to add. But one thing I will mention that folks are doing, and I have to say I was pretty skeptical of this use case. I had a startup school member that did it, and I said, I've never seen this done before. I don't really know if that's going to work is the concept of private dedicated desk rooms.

00:20:36 So you take a team, you know, you take a larger office, maybe it's five or, you know, five seems like a good number to me and the dedicated desk. So you put desks in the office and you don't fell the office to one team. You sell it to individuals who want a dedicated desk within a private office. So sometimes you're going to be there together,

00:20:57 but probably they won't all be there at the same time because of how, you know, usage of the space work. So maybe half of them are there at any given time. So you're still competing if you're on a phone call and that kind of thing. But I think it's that some people simply do not want to work in a very large open space.

00:21:14 It doesn't fit their personality and how they work best. And so I've seen a number of operators test this, and it's going really well. And some of them are making those rooms really nice, beautiful artwork on the walls and nice paint on the walls, extra monitors on the desk, which people really like, you know, they style the space and they make it really attractive and compelling.

00:21:36 Really, you know, the usual nice chairs, nice, nice desks. And those are working. And I was talking to one operator who said that they had someone join, who, who joined because they had that option. So might be something to test. If you're sitting on a team suite, that's not moving, you might make it a dedicated desk room.

00:21:56 And again, providing access to offices through mix and match options and phone booths. So one of the other sort of ideas around what you sell that I wanted to share is the HQ model. And we talked about this week, I talked about this on the bud guests last week as an offering that generally larger operators are, are offering for those small business corporate groups that need more space and want some privacy.

00:22:29 So in that, so the HQ model HQ is short for headquarters. So it's like a mini headquarters and there are different names for these. So if you want to look at models, you know, search online and see what they look like. Expansive has a smart, sweet brand. Industrious has a brand called canvas. We work runs this model IQ,

00:22:49 which is Kane Welmont company. They do HQ by IQ. You can Google that how Australia offers team suites, launch workplaces offers, move in ready teams suites. And then they're independent operators who are doing this within the building. The post in Tucson is offering this model. And so the HQ model is separate space. It's separate physically from your coworking space.

00:23:15 It may even have a separate entrance, which a lot of folks like. So this is for the company that wants to be sort of adjacent and involved with coworking, but doesn't is too big or wants their own culture or their own entrance or their own branding and their own kind of configuration outside of the shared workspace. So it's private to them, but they have access to the coworking space.

00:23:41 The space is generally furnished. The spaces tech ready, and the space gets one point of contact, which might be your community manager to help manage the space. So it's managed slash service private space. So it's different from a tech spec suite. So you've probably heard that term, a spec suite would be a smaller floor plate. So a thousand square feet,

00:24:05 a 2000 square feet that sort of pre-built out to match, you know, maybe a typical layout for a smaller company, but it's not generally furnished. It's not generally tech ready and they don't get a point of contact to help them manage the space. So if they have a problem with the internet, that's their problem. They have to get the internet set up and installed on their own.

00:24:29 Whereas the HQ model, the coworking space is still managing and servicing that space. They may not be making the coffee and doing it, you know, doing supply orders, but they're one point of contact. If they need something that members coming to them versus going to the landlord or having to call the internet company on their own and they're helping furnish it and configure it.

00:24:50 And we talked last week on the episode about how there are companies like feather court is doing this. There are furniture as a service companies that are helping to support this model by having more on demand options that you can get into the space that meet the needs of the member. So maybe the member needs a space for 40 people, and they want, you know,

00:25:13 a mix of hot desks meeting rooms and some phone rooms, you know, might be typical. If they need a boardroom, they don't need their own boardroom. They can share the boardroom in the co-working space. If they do an offsite once a quarter, and they have more folks come in from another location, they can do that. The coworking space,

00:25:30 if they host events, they can do that in the coworking space. So oftentimes the HQ model is run, you know, within a building where there's already a highly serviced coworking space. So they get access to those amenities. So if you're an operator and you're looking to service these groups that don't really fit into the plan that you have in your coworking space already,

00:25:50 this might be something you do in a partnership with your landlord. So you might work with them and say, look, you know, I'll manage this, but I don't want to sign a lease. Let's do our rev share. You know, that might be a model that you explore because your landlord probably doesn't want to deal with the furnishing and tech,

00:26:09 enabling the space and being the point of contact when the internet is down. Great. You're equipped for that. You have a community manager or an operations manager or some combination of those folks. So the HQ model is worth looking at if that's an end-user that you want to service a couple of other models that I see coming up more and more. I have a couple of folks in my startup school and in our management agreement course who are looking at co warehousing and shared medical office.

00:26:40 So that's just kind of a side note, but in of what you sell, we're seeing different shared models coming up. One other model that I wanted to point out, and I have a couple of folks in my startup school who are working on this one that just started his build out doing co-working plus coffee bar under the same roof. So this is,

00:27:03 I think a lot of folks think about doing this and adding coffee, and I'm gonna sort of borrow from my other sources of revenue bucket. When I talk about this coffee is a very, very location sensitive model. So you have to be in a very high foot traffic area, which may mean that, that doesn't also work for coworking. So, but if you want to do a smaller coworking space and sort of subsidize that model with revenue,

00:27:30 from a coffee house, and you find a really great, you know, high traffic area in which to do that, that may be a way to make it work because our sort of main street co-working spaces often struggle with finding enough space to get the model to work the way we want it to. Right. A 2000 square foot space is, is really challenging if you want to staff it.

00:27:55 So you can share the staff with the coffee bar or We're have a more lightly staffed model on your coworking side. And then you can go heavy on the offices on the co-working side, because you've got lounge areas that maybe some are reservable in the coffee bar side. But again, you just want to be really careful with that because they're very, very location sensitive in order to get the volume that you need to make a coffee bar work,

00:28:28 putting a coffee bar within a co-working space, it's kind of off on its own and not going to attract other foot traffic is hard to make really viable from a financial model. I have another member who actually just integrated a coffee delivery kiosk into his space. So he's partnering with our local coffee operator who does coffee delivery. And this took me by surprise a little bit because it never occurred to me to order coffee,

00:28:55 but he said they have an app. And delivery is a really popular way for people to get coffee these days, which probably happened during COVID, right? So he said, if he can set up this kiosk, he can serve his members who want cappuccinos or other espresso drinks. Then the barista can handle that Burke. The barista's salary is paid by the delivery model,

00:29:18 which I thought was really interesting. So that kind of transitions into our next kind of bucket of what you sell, which is other sources of revenue. And this kind of always comes up for co-working spaces. And if you're interested in figuring out, you know, what else can I add? That makes sense for a coworking space, it can bring in more revenue.

00:29:39 Here are some ideas that our flight group members and co-working startups, school members are thinking about. Vending snack bars seems simple, but I've heard a lot of folks say, they're experimenting with this and it's going well, it's a convenience. If you're in more of an office park environment where you're not really walkable to other food and beverage, you're not right next door to the Starbucks or,

00:30:03 you know, or some other place to get food. Of course people can get delivery, but sometimes you even, that's a hassle and it can be really expensive to order in lunch. And so they have, you know, basic like hard-boiled eggs is a popular one that one of our members had mentioned. And I, you know, I trend towards the healthier options.

00:30:23 One, one of the GWA members mentioned recently that they were doing really well with vending. Although she did say it's location specific, to some extent she's vending does really well in some of their locations, but not in all of their locations. But she said the vending company told her that the most popular vending item is pop tarts. And so if you want to sell more vending items,

00:30:47 you want to stock pop tarts. This is not for the good of the health of your members, for sure, but having more of a fresh snack bar. And so some of these things they're stocking so different models, right? You can ha you can sort of lease equipment and get it stocked, or you can lease the equipment and stock at yourself.

00:31:07 And one of my members is, you know, doing the Costco run and stocking it themselves. And they have a partnership with some local like sandwich salad folks. You know, he is quick to caution that now you're managing spoilage. If you have fresh food, like things like hard-boiled eggs, right? So you have to kind of understand your volume. And he said,

00:31:25 it's taking them a couple of months to kind of get up to speed and figure out, you know, what, how to, how to manage all of it really well. But folks are having some success with that. Another big topic of conversation in our groups has been VA services. So offering extra support to your members, this can be tricky because we're already struggling to,

00:31:45 you know, attract and retain community managers. So adding, you know, another resource that we need to recruit and retain can be challenging, but we have a lot of folks in our space who can use help on their businesses in sort of more of an, you know, an ad hoc or light option. So again, here, I would say,

00:32:07 make sure you're selling recurring well, different folks in our groups do it in different ways. I really like the recurring package model. So that would enable you to commit to a VA. You could start with say, you know, 20 hours a week part-time and then sell packages, sell five hour a week packages to your members. You need to sell four of them to pay for this person.

00:32:30 And then you take, you know, the extra fee. So maybe you build this person out at $25 an hour, you're paying her $20 all in you take the incremental five. And, you know, you're just providing her as access. You do have to manage the onboarding of the member. One of the things that came up with teaching members, how to use virtual assistants,

00:32:52 so helping them understand, you know, what do they even do with a virtual assistant that can be a heavy lift for a new business, and then managing sort of time tracking and invoicing. So you want to be careful that you're charging enough to kind of account for that extra admin time. And then of course, our usual, you know, virtual office,

00:33:11 digital mail charging for Google, my business listings, et cetera. So just to kind of recap here, we talked about what we sell and rethinking some of the aspects of what we sell, offering flexibility through, you know, open space plus bucket of office hours, for example, providing more privacy, so dedicated desks within offices, more phone booths. We talked about the HQ model as a different way to serve members that you may not be attracting.

00:33:43 At this point, we talked about other models like shared medical code warehousing, adding the coffee bar, which also falls into sources of revenue, vending VA services, virtual office, digital mail, and adding that coffee bar, if it makes sense. So just some food for thought, in terms of what we're hearing about. We are going to open registration for our operator membership,

00:34:07 which currently we call our flight group. If you're interested in joining us and want access to what other operators are up to and be able to engage in those conversations and ask questions and hot seat and bring things into the table. We're also going to shift to a big focus on implementation and helping folks get, know what they need to get done in their business and actually get it done.

00:34:29 Make sure you're on our mailing list. You can go to our website and get our on our mailing list. And we are going to open that up November, December of 2021. So thanks for joining me today. And next week, we're going to continue our discussion about the new rules of engagement and we have some great interviews coming up as well. Hey there,

00:34:49 thanks for sticking with us through the end of the episode, don't forget to subscribe on your favorite podcast player. And if you were enjoying the podcast, please go leave us a review. It helps other folks find the podcast who are thinking about starting a coworking space or already operating a coworking space and are looking to stay up to speed on tips and trends.

00:35:13 And we started a YouTube channel. We'd love to have you catch us on video. You can join us for podcast, videos, and Q and a videos and other things that we post to the channel. We'd love to see you.

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