257. What’s Working for Coworking Spaces Running Google Ads?
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TRANSCRIPTION
257. What’s Working for Coworking Spaces Running Google Ads?
00:00:03 Welcome to the Everything Coworking podcast, where every week I keep you updated on the latest trends and how tos in Coworking. I owned and operated coworking spaces for eight years, and then served as the executive director of the global workspace association for five years. And today I work with hundreds of operators and community managers every month, allowing me to bring you thought provoking operator,
00:00:29 case studies and inspirational interviews with industry thought leaders to help you confidently stay on top of what's important and what you can apply to your own role in the Coworking industry. Welcome to the Everything Coworking podcast. I'm glad to have you here with me today. I am talking to Reuben Lau. Reuben has been on the podcast before episode number 195. If you want to do a little review of that one on that episode,
00:01:01 he talked about SCO and SCM tips for coworking spaces. Today, we are talking about what is working for coworking spaces, running Google ads, and he has some GC updates on the Google ad platform that I've found to be super interesting. So I can't wait to dive into that before we start, I have to congratulate our latest certified Coworking Community Manager, Nestle Herrera.
00:01:29 She is the Community Manager at Iona workspaces, which is in Alumba California, in Los Angeles county. So congrats Nestle. We're so thrilled to have you with us and excited that you got your certification. So I get this awesome update. We hired this automation guy on Upwork, and if you, I, lots of people will talk about automation and, you know,
00:01:55 look for opportunities to see what can be automated. And for us, this was just a huge challenge to figure out like how to even make it happen. So I went to Upwork and I hired a guy who specializes in automations. This was for type form to active campaign. So I get this awesome email. When someone finishes their certification, please prepare a certificate for the student from Active Campaign.
00:02:21 So I love it. I get it. My team gets it and they celebrate immediately. So just wanted to share the automation piece. If you are working on automating your own business, Upwork can be a great resource. I love Upwork for basically everything under the sun. Anytime we can't figure something out, we're like, let's just get somebody from Upwork to do this.
00:02:43 So anyway, I had to share that tip and now let's dive into my conversation with Reuben. I am here with Reuben Lauer. He is an online marketing strategist, and more importantly for our audience. He helped coworking spaces fill up faster by running Google ads and optimizing their SDL. I'll let Reuben kind of finesse that intro. Reuben. I'm so glad you're here.
00:03:09 So Rubin has been on the podcast before he was on episode 1 95. Reuben were in the two fifties now. So it's been a little bit, And I know Jeff's Nicola initially. It was like, how do you not know Reuben? He does Google ads for coworking spaces. And so Rubin is on the podcast. And since then he works with a number of folks in our new,
00:03:32 it was our Flight Group program. Now it's the Everything Coworking academy program. And so I reached out to Rubin. I initially reached out because I had a little bit of a, a myth come up in one of our slack groups. And I said, Reuben, I want to talk about this. And so we're going to talk about that and just kind of like what's happening out there that we've been seeing across his clients,
00:03:53 but on an exciting front Rubin. And I got to meet in person at the GC event in Seattle. So yeah, that was awesome. Yeah, It's totally good to be back in connecting with people in person and Reuben's taller than I thought he was, I guess in zoom, we're all kind of stuck in the same box. I saw somebody else in a photo the other day and I was like,
00:04:15 oh, you shorter than I thought it's yeah, exactly. It's sort of like normalizes everyone. So it was super fun to connect. You only got to talk for a few minutes at a happy hour, Liz and I actually just did a debrief on the other podcast and you and I were talking at the happy hour at pioneer collective, which was very loud.
00:04:31 She thought she's like, you know, we thought like 50 people would come and it was like Packed. There's a lot. So There's a lot of people there. It was loud and fun. And I immediately started hitting Rubin with my own Google ads questions. And I was like, Reuben, I have this funnel and this is what's happening. So I'm excited to chat today.
00:04:50 So Reuben, thank you. Tell us a little bit more about your work and you know, anything else that you want to remind us of since episode 1 95? Yeah. So we're still focused on the Coworking industry and even more so nowadays focusing more heavily into the SCM side of it. So as you know, we do design development, SEO search engine optimization and search engine marketing or Google ads.
00:05:13 We're just focused a lot on Google ads, just because we see that as low-hanging fruit easier to get leads in the door, turns around a lot quicker and you can see results almost near immediately. So yeah, that's where our focus is most of the time, these days. Awesome. Yeah. So we're going to talk about a couple of things today.
00:05:32 The first question that I'm going to hit Reuben with is, and I it's been a while since I emailed him as like Rubin, this question came up in our slack group and Reuben, thank you for always, you're always responding and giving context, whenever somebody has a question and you take the time out and give a nice thorough response, which I super appreciate.
00:05:55 And so do our members, but so we'll kind of start with like, when should I consider running Google ads and, and, you know, part B, which is sort of the, kind of the myths that came up in the group is, you know, does budget size matter and related to that, like, you know, who's my competition market size.
00:06:15 There's a lot to unpack there. So we have more questions. So we won't spend too much time on that, but I would love to just have you walk through, like, you know, when you talk to a new client, what are the things that you sort of look at to determine, do Google ads make sense for this person? When should,
00:06:32 you know, when should people start thinking it's time to run them. Yeah, generally speaking, we'd be like, if you have space to feel like offices or Coworking memberships to fill, it's a good time to run Google ads. I know that sounds very generic and applies to everybody, but you do spend a lot of time, like on your SEO,
00:06:49 your website, you know, your Google, my business, optimizing your Google maps, listing, all of those can actually be impact with Google ads, right? So if you value those, it's natural that you would value Google ads as well, because it just gets you higher up on the page. That being said, we typically see Google ads being more beneficial for recurring services.
00:07:09 So that would be like Office deaths. I don't know, like a one year or six month lease or like a quirky memberships, which auto renew or whatnot, just typically because those services have a larger or longer lifetime value of customer. So they may say four years or months. So that ROI just continues to compound as a, stay a member or a customer of yours.
00:07:32 So that said, we usually start with offices and Coworking just because those will have larger RRI, but we also do Google ads for like meeting spaces, event spaces, or virtual office, those types of services. Yeah. Any questions on, Oh, you know, I do have a question and I'm going to save it for the, you know, what are you seeing in the marketplace right now?
00:07:52 So, yeah. I love that point about you really kind of looking for lifetime value so that you can make sure there's an ROI on the ad spend. That's what's going to justify sort of the cost and the continuous spend. So there's natural churn in any business. So as you know, opposites get empty, you need to build those backups. So yeah,
00:08:12 that really segues nicely into like the competition or market size, which is a big factor. Like a lot of people are scared at like the cost per click, because that's what Google goes off of. It's, it's an auction based system, as we know. So you are competing against other competitors in your area. So typically the larger the market, the more competitors you have,
00:08:32 typically, the more you'll need to spend to attract those customers. But there are ways to outperform your existing competition by just understanding your audience a little bit better. And I know you talk about this a lot in your podcast. It's like, what's your niche? Who are you trying to focus on? What is the buyer persona? So like things like,
00:08:49 where do they live? That's a big one. So for smaller spaces, we might just draw like a 15 minute driving radius and just target those specific people. Cause you don't need to waste additional ad spend on people that are farther than that. Or possibly like how old are they, if you don't have many members that are between the ages of 18 to 24,
00:09:08 we can not show our ads to that age group. And even things Like how old I am. Is that what you're saying? And yeah, we can talk about more about how Google is starting to leverage that information. But another targeting method is by like interest in hobbies. So like, do you like gardening or do you frequent a copy's coffee shop regularly?
00:09:31 Those are some sort of things that Google can let you optimize your ads for, which helps you run more efficiently and really just serve your ads to those people that are searching. So yeah, in the past, we've leveraged Google ads for all sizes of spaces, whether they're brand new or they're established or they have multiple locations. So one example I want to bring up since they've been on your podcast recently was killer co-works.
00:09:54 So as you know, Amir and Christina, they run a coworking space out of Lafayette in California. And Lafayette only has a population of 25,000. So we ran their ads for them for about six to seven months. And now they're completely full on the offices side. So it can work on like smaller locations or less competitive markets, I would say. And it can even work for like larger ones than other examples,
00:10:19 like beat up Coworking from Portland. Yeah. So Melanie, over there, we throttled budget between offices and Coworking. So we call them like tracks, right? So we ran a campaign for offices and we'd run a campaign for Coworking. And as she gets filled up on offices, we'll shift budget and balance it back to Coworking. So we can kind of move that budget around,
00:10:41 like on a daily basis if needed, but usually on like a monthly or quarterly basis as we get those occupancy numbers. And then we have other clients that just leave things on all the time. They are full at times and they just want to generate a waiting list so that they remain full. So anytime there's an upcoming vacancy, they can just hit that list,
00:11:00 say opening. So there are a lot of different techniques to run Google ads, but it starts a lot of different markets. The pillar example is super helpful cause Vita Melanie was on the podcast a long time ago, but her community managers in our Community Manager program, she's in Portland. Right. Which is a major market, a lot of competition. So it,
00:11:22 yeah, I loved the Lafayette example in a smaller market because twenty-five thousand is yeah. On the smaller side. And I feel like when they were on the podcast, they had offices open and I was like, how could this be? You know, you usually, so it's a great tool. I'm glad to hear that's working. And the Coworking, can I ask you in terms of ROI,
00:11:44 just to kind of follow through for people who are wondering, so one thing that's happened post COVID is that I used to be very much in the camp of you want to sell full-time memberships, you can maybe sell partial access, but it should be very expensive. And post COVID people's work behaviors are so different that a lot of folks are doing 10 day passes and those churn more.
00:12:09 So I don't know if there's a clear answer here, but if you're running to ads to like a landing page, are you trying to isolate like a higher ticket item? Or are you just doing the math to say, okay, if somebody stays for six months on a 10 day pass and my acquisition cost is X, it works. Like, how do you think about that?
00:12:31 That's a great question. Yeah. So we typically want to understand what the goal is of that space and what types of members are looking to get in as well as what's a good fit for that audience that we're, that we're attracting. So Coworking is a great one because people that search Coworking on Google understand what it is. They've likely used a co-working space before,
00:12:52 or are currently even in a space looking for an alternative. So they really understand it. So there's not much education that needs to happen. Usually what we try to do for those for that market is get them in the door, get them through the tour and make sure that they love the space and the space should really sell itself depending on how you want to slice up the membership options.
00:13:11 That's really up to the space, but we try to report on an ROI based on the leads that we're generating and the revenue that they're receiving. And then you can take that revenue as being recurring and track that over the lifetime value. So it really varies. But at the end of the day, we're trying to drive people in through the doors, through Google ads to tour the space so that they can fall in love with the space and want to work there and then they can figure out the membership pricing.
00:13:37 Okay. Yeah. Hey, I just wanted to jump in really quickly before we continue with our discussion. If you're working on opening a co-working space, I want to invite you to join me for my free masterclass three behind the scenes secrets to opening a coworking space. If you're working on opening a co-working space, I want to share the three decisions that I've seen successful operators make when they're creating their Coworking business.
00:14:04 The masterclass is totally free. It's about an hour and includes some Q and a. If you'd like to join me, you can register at Everything Coworking dot com forward slash masterclass. If you already have a coworking space, I want to make sure you know, about Community Manager, University, Community Manager, University is a training and development platform for community managers.
00:14:26 And it can be for owner operators. It has content training resources templates from day one to general manager. The platform includes many courses that cover the major buckets of the Community Manager role from community management, operations, sales, and marketing, finance, and leadership. The content is laid out in a graduated learning path. So the Community Manager can identify what content is most relevant to them,
00:14:53 depending on their experience and kind of jump in from there. We provide a live brand new training every single month for the Community Manager group. We also host a live Q and a call every single month so that the community managers can work through any challenges that they're having or opportunities get ideas from other community managers build their own peer network. We also have a private slack group for the group.
00:15:20 So if you're interested in learning more, you can go to Everything, Coworking dot com forward slash Community Manager. So in terms of tracking lifetime value, this is a topic that comes up a lot because most of the face management platforms like an officer and D they don't do it really easily. Do your clients tend to do it sort of manually? Do you have any tricks that we're missing?
00:15:45 Most of it is manual for the most part. Yeah. So whenever a lead closes, they'll mark that as Juan pad, but the dollar amount is whether or not it's recurring And just tracking it. Yeah, Yeah, yeah. Otherwise you can go a little bit higher up on the funnel and say like, did they book a tour or were you able to connect with them?
00:16:05 So yeah, one thing we're working on internally, and this is probably a couple months later, is we're working on ways to evaluate and put a numeric value on a lead. So that's going to be a little bit more proprietary, but because lead generation is not like e-commerce where I go and purchase a widget for $10 or a hundred dollars or a thousand dollars.
00:16:25 So you can see the immediate value leads are more ambiguous, right. You know, it's maybe a great lead, not such a great lead, or maybe they booked a meeting room for one hour or they signed up for 12 months of an office. There's different valuations there. And the more we can record and communicate that value to Google, the better Google can do at finding us more of that audience.
00:16:50 Oh, interesting. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Like you would do in your CRM, but you're trying to help Google do it. Yeah. That's the more signals we can send Google about the value of that lead that was just received. The more insight it has on attracting more of that audience. Yeah. Yeah. So I think this came up at GC.
00:17:13 What do you, I, I think there are AI platforms that are helping people run ads. This is a surprise question. Sorry, Reuben. What's your, what's your 2 cents on that? How do you think about that as an option? Yeah, I would say be very careful like Google has its own auto applied recommendations, which is pushing really heavily on.
00:17:35 We get calls every day from Google trying to turn this on. I actually learned they get compensated whenever we turn it on. It's crazy Incentives. That's an important point. And that's what I always try to like when somebody is like, well, I just talked my Google ad rep and they told me to do this. And I'm like, and they get paid for that.
00:17:53 So careful, like they don't get paid like, like you have a fee, a management fee and then your incentives are to get great results so that people continue to, I think it's a little different. So yeah. I get anxious about the incentives that the ad spokes have from Google. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. These auto apply recommendations. Can you just need to be very careful about which ones to turn on because it can change and automatically change your bid strategy,
00:18:21 your ads, your ad, copy your audiences, your keywords, All the things that are very intentional and very well-researched and Yeah. That's right. So yeah, just be very careful. That's one of the things that we're seeing in Google right now that we would say to be very mindful of, there's probably about 20 to 25 different auto apply recommendations. We typically only leave on two or three.
00:18:47 So kind of back to the low hanging fruit with Google and, you know, the pillar example in a smaller market, do you ever get clients who are simply like, there's not enough search volume or there's not enough awareness? Like do those folks kind of show up and what does that look like? They do. So that typically just translates to a smaller budget.
00:19:09 There's just less people searching so we can go broader. So we can go broader with our geography. We can find where people are traveling through maybe from, to try and target those cities. And there are other ways to create more awareness on Google. Like one of the newer campaign types that we're super excited about is called performance. Max campaigns. It's a funny name,
00:19:33 but it's, Google's way of trying to create a campaign type that is goal-based. So what's kind of cool about that. And this, I think ties well into your question is you can now start to target people with interests or purchasing tensions, certain things. So an example that I pulled straight out from Google ads recently for performance max, is targeting people that have a purchase intention of coworking office space.
00:20:00 So that's brand new to us like before we could only target, you know, how old they are. If they're like gardening, if they're at a 15 mile like minute radius, now we can go as deep as like have these search for purchasing shared workspaces recently. So that's like a huge signal for us. Another way that we can target people is through websites,
00:20:23 they've browsed, or that are similar to websites. They browse. So you can type in like a competitor. So if you want to target, let's say we were, for example, you just say people that have browse, we worked recently, so that automatically Like a Facebook sort of thing. That's Lookalike audience targeting. So not only do they need to be actively searching for coworking space if they were in a smaller market,
00:20:47 but now if they've searched, you know, within the last couple of weeks, they may be searched your ad in various different locations. Like maybe YouTube or display advertising. Yeah. Another one. Yeah. Wait, did I do, did I sneak us into like things that you're seeing are working in Google ads? Totally. Yeah. Okay. And you,
00:21:09 you said, oh, there might be some things you're interested in that one sounds pretty intriguing. Yeah. Okay. Continue. Okay. And another one is like on the same vein as just people using certain apps. So as you know, like Office RnD has, it's like booking app, it's checking that nexus has their own apps as well. So similarly,
00:21:30 if that, if your potential audience or customer has that happened solved in their phone, you can now target them. So these can all be done like together in addition to sending other data signals of your own. So did they assign up to your newsletter? Did they visit your pricing page? Did they fill in your contact form? Did they go through the Calendly tour booking systems?
00:21:53 The retargeting from, And these are all combined or can be combined? So it's interesting how Google ads, for the most part, we use it for very bottom of the funnel, right. People that are searching coworking spaces near me, people that have that immediate need opens it up a lot more and targets And Reuben. Right. I feel like, whoa.
00:22:17 Yeah. It's pretty exciting for this year. It is. We'll also, I feel like I often, you know, I I've studied Facebook ads more because I feel like it's slightly more approachable to do it yourself. Although not always in Google ads. And I've always said, right, if you need awareness, that's Facebook, not Google ads because Google ads is search activity.
00:22:40 Right. So I already know it I'm searching for it, but these things kind of, but it is opening to your point. It's moving up the funnel quite a bit. I mean, not always because it's a little tangential, but you could, right. To your point, if you get some insights like, oh, people who search for these things are likely to be in the market.
00:22:58 That's right. Yeah. And there's a lot of signals that Google has. And this kind of opened our eyes to the amount of data that Google is collecting All sorts of things. And so it can make decisions and find common denominators within your target market that maybe you weren't even aware of. For example, going back to the gardening thing is if it finds out a lot of your audience does enjoy gardening or something,
00:23:27 then it can make that connection and correlation and target more people that not only have visited. We worked out calmly recently, but also like gardening. So it's kind of cool that it can put all those pieces together and make it more precise in its targeting. And yeah, YouTube ads, display advertising, Google discover. Those are actually huge platforms that we rarely tap,
00:23:51 unless you have larger budgets now because of its precision, we can participate in those. So Google will actually go ahead and create image ads for you. If you don't have them and you just upload some photos, upload some taglines and it'll create these ads for you. And you can be seen all over the web through the display network. Okay. So it's not just search anymore.
00:24:13 It's broadening it out. Even. Although search is still where we focus at the very bottom of the funnel. And often it's a highest conversion point, but still it's nice to be able to participate in that entire funnel because Google sees a lot more than we do in terms of Yeah. Well into your, again, if you're in a market where the search volume might be a little lower,
00:24:33 right. You can go after some of these other, it just makes it a lot more like strategic. It feels like you have to really think more about, yeah. Do you have clients that are doing display ads? We do. Yeah. So they, they work, but again, they are a little bit more top of funnel, so we can mix that in with like remarketing to make it more precise.
00:24:58 But yeah, usually generally is if you want to go with like broader with your ads, regardless of the medium, the more costly it would be. So think about like billboard ads versus like your local newspaper ad. Right. So yeah. So we kind of mix those two together, but yeah, this one platform will help you get into all, all of the Google platforms,
00:25:20 display search. Yeah. Usually right now, right. About for, for my business. Maybe not as relevant for coworking spaces. Interesting. What else is new? What is working? Yeah, not new, but working still is the lining page experiments. I know we touched on this slightly last time. So we do create custom landing pages for all of our Google ads.
00:25:43 So if you're running ads for office spaces, we'll have a custom landing page for office spaces. If you're running Coworking ads, we'll have a custom landing page for Coworking. But one interesting thing we've been toying with is just social proof. So things like reviews, star ratings, and textiles On the landing page. Yeah. So that, that can be served in different formats.
00:26:07 We have small pop-ups. We have the testimonials embedded, we have carousels of testimonials and what's interesting is tested on multiple clients and through an AB test. So one version has no social proof. The other version has social group. We're seeing about a 13% increase in conversion rate. Just from that one change. I know you think about your budget. Let's say it's a thousand dollars now you've saved,
00:26:32 you know, 10% of that potentially. Right? Yeah. So that's kind of the learnings that we take and we are constantly trying, not all of them win, but the ones that do we try and see if it's applicable to all of our clients and if they are, then we'll just roll them out. Site-wide and we'll measure obviously. And we still do the split test,
00:26:51 but 13% is a pretty big jump, but it's just to say, I think a lot of Google ads optimization, you feel maybe done on the Google ads platform. And that is true. But usually where we see the biggest gains is on the lining page, because not everybody's going to read every single piece of text on your ad, right. It's usually a quick search click with,
00:27:11 they see something relevant and they're spending most of their time on your landing page. So just spend the necessary time and effort there to optimize it, because that can be a huge way to save on your Google ad spend and make it more effective for you, Reuben, for anybody that did not hear episode 1 95, which everyone should go back and listen to,
00:27:30 but can you just walk through kind of what is a landing page and why do we use those for Google ads? Yeah. So in a nutshell, we use it to hone the user in on the objective that you want. And also what helps them get further in their search. So aligning page is usually one page that talks specifically about a certain service and it owns a user in on usually one single call to action,
00:27:59 whether that's booking a tour or making a purchase or contacting you somehow, it really just focuses the user because the alternative to that would be to drive your ad traffic to your website, which a lot of people do. But on your website, you have a lot of information, right? You talk about virtual office, your team members, your office spaces.
00:28:18 There's just a lot of variety of information and a lot of ways for people to get distracted, they might have And click on the wrong thing down the rabbit hole and then the doorbell rings and then they forget what they were even looking for. Yeah. Yeah. So we just try to like distill what the next step is for that user. So if it's like office space,
00:28:38 maybe it's inviting them in for a tour or maybe just getting a link to a virtual tour these days. So just trying to figure out what that next step is for that user and offering it up to them. And usually we use some form of way to capture their information so we can reach back out to them. So it's like a link to our virtual tour,
00:28:57 or if it's a link to a Calendly booking form, those are just ways that people can get in touch with you and get the information. Do you have a perspective on having the virtual tour be in front of an opt-in or behind an opt-in? So we test both and it really varies. I've seen different levels of quality of virtual tours too. Yeah.
00:29:22 One that does it really well as launch in would have, Hey, yeah. He has like actual videos embedded into the Matterport kind of somebody guiding you through the demo is really cool. Yeah. I think it's more of like a premium Matterport example, but I thought that was super engaging, especially if you've looked at a few that would put that In the show notes,
00:29:42 by the way, for anybody listening, that's Jason Abbott, right. That's right. And he was a JC. I got to meet him for the first time. So Yeah. So there's really no like golden rule for that one, I would say. And it depends on the service too, and also what your space looks like and who you're attracting. Right.
00:30:02 So it could really vary. But do we do use that in some instances to get like a lead, we'll send you a link to our virtual tour, so you can try both to see what the engagement is like. And even if you do put it behind a paywall after they've viewed it and you've sent Lincoln, they've taken a look and went through that virtual tour,
00:30:21 like what's the conversion rate look like for that? Yeah. Cause you might just be spinning your wheels a little bit and putting it behind a paywall and then sending them the link and then they just do nothing with it. So in those instances, maybe it's better just to display it and then get the qualified leads. It also depends on your resources too.
00:30:38 Do you have the time to follow up on every single lead and like hound them, like call them consistently email them consistently? So if your resources are smaller, we have, we have ways to try and boost the quality of the leads instead of quantity. Whereas if you do have the resources, we want to give you as many leads as Possible So that you can remarket them or put them into your newsletter funnel,
00:31:00 et cetera. So there's different strategies for different spaces. So I'm curious, we talked about, you know, some people may or may not choose to do campaigns for meeting rooms because is the lifetime value? Their meeting rooms is one of those categories that post COVID is like really big for some people. Have you seen that start to come up and are you doing more meeting room ads yet?
00:31:26 Or what, what does that look like? It hasn't really grown too much in terms of clients wanting to grow their meeting rooms through Google ads. But I have seen a pickup in the clients that are running ads for me. And that's the conversion. Yeah. Cost per conversion has gone down. It does seem like there's a little bit more competition, but not Fastly.
00:31:49 So yeah, I do feel people are using the meeting rooms, which is great. So I, I think there's an opportunity there, but yeah, to your point, lifetime value of a meeting room is usually one hour to the day or maybe a few days on the rare occasion is nice if they come back. So if it's like a quarterly review or maybe it's HR looking to do interviews or whatnot,
00:32:08 those are great. So it's a little bit trickier, I think, from an ROI perspective, but we do have clients running. Doesn't have they're running successfully. Yeah. Yeah. We just hear kind of, yeah. Anecdotally and we have some folks who I know are working with you or a testing, like meeting room memberships and trying to get that kind of recurring mindset going with folks that book.
00:32:30 I also have heard that larger meeting rooms are selling more because people are looking a place to do a sales team meeting or an all hands. So more like the training room style. And then it's probably a keyword you'd probably have to kind of manage the keywords a little bit there depending on what's the, what are people trying to buy? Yeah. And I think those bigger spaces are definitely more profitable.
00:32:57 Just the dollar per hour. There is more, and it kind of bleeds into event spaces too, and trying to rent out this space for hours or an evening. So yeah. It's interesting to see how things are still changing with Yeah. In different across geographies. Right. I know Canada is still a little bit yeah. Behind getting there. Yeah.
00:33:19 What else should we know about what's happening today in with Google ads? I think those are like the main cause of the highlight. Yeah. I think you asked really great questions. Yeah. Nothing too much. At this point we can go into like valuing the lead a little bit more in attribution, but maybe we can save that for another episode. It's,
00:33:40 it's, it's more complex, but at the same time, like with the new performance max campaigns, we can already see that we need to be clearer with where the values are or where we're getting value from certain leads. And that's becoming really apparent with the performance max campaigns. And it just allows us to allow Google to do a better job. If we're not communicating,
00:34:04 we're not tracking conversions, we're not tracking events, we're not uploading customer data lists. Then Google is just going to go up there and find you clicks. And that's not really what we want. We want more conversions, more high quality leads. So that's where I feel things are trending. So it's good to set that up earlier than later so that you can start collecting that information much like remarketing,
00:34:25 there needs to be a base pool there before Google can start to connect the dots for again. And is that, so where does that get set up? It gets set up through like analytics is usually where you would set up your conversions and then there's other data signals that you can send to Google through custom events through your website, also through analytics, or you can send data after post-click back to Google.
00:34:51 So like we talked briefly about assigning a value per lead that would be done after the fact is so one thing that we might be experimenting with is after you receive a phone call from say your Google ads, we would send you an email after maybe five minutes after saying like, how was that call? That was there. Did you see value there? Were you able to connect for the,
00:35:11 in the right geography? What service were they looking for? Did they convert et cetera? So we can start to feed that data back to Google after the fact, and then there's sources where you can just upload. So Google allows you to upload like a encrypted version of your customers. So again, it can find similarities. Cause if I'm a customer there they'll know that I like gardening or something and it will start to make those connections within your customers and against use that to find other like customers in the future.
00:35:43 That's super interesting. So is it like the Facebook pixel where it doesn't collect that data until you've set it up? Yeah, absolutely. All of this needs to be done manually. They used to go in, set it up so that it's being collected. Yeah, That's right. Yeah. And also assigned a value if you want to go down that route,
00:36:04 which is a little bit more arbitrary, but I feel necessary because we all know or have some gut feeling of whether or not a lead is relevant. Right. Yeah. I was going to say right. It might feel arbitrary, but I think most people could score a lead after a better phone call or even an email exchange. Yeah. Yeah. That's right.
00:36:23 So just any signal to tell Google that quality, otherwise Google values all leads as one and that's not helping because it'll see that phone call and it wasn't really a great quality. It'll go and find you more. And that's not what we want. We want to tell Google that, that wasn't great, but the next one was really good. And then they'll go and find out,
00:36:44 find you better ones. So yeah, it's a learning process for Google and it sees a lot more than we do. And so we should try and leverage that as much as possible by providing insightful feedback. Yeah. Interesting. Google's getting smarter. Reuben, thank you for joining us. I think this is one of those things. Like things are always changing.
00:37:04 And I think the unique perspective that you have is that working with multiple Coworking clients, you're, you're constantly testing. You're seeing what's working and apply that to different clients. So I love to get your Intel and you were right. I am excited about some of the things that are happening. So thank you for taking the time to do that. You mentioned.
00:37:25 Can you tell us about your Google ads blueprint offer? Yeah. Similar to the last time, I'd love to offer like a discount to our Google ads blueprint, which basically allows us the chance to work together and explore how Google ads can work for your space. So it's a one-time engagement. We usually charge $600 for it and we're offering a preferential dollars to your listeners,
00:37:46 but essentially it's a one-time engagement, which allows us to go through things like mapping out your goals, to develop a custom strategy, a understanding of what budget you need to spend based on your geography and based on your targeting, we analyze your competitors, what ads they're running, what they're bidding. We also forecast return on investment and we do that by mixing in our industry insight and what Google tells us as well.
00:38:11 And we identify what your campaign structure should look like. So what tracks you should be running, what lead magnets we should be presenting on those tracks. And then we also audit your online tracking. So we touched a bit on, you know, how to set up analytics and events and things like that. We'll audit that just to make sure you're sending the right signals to Google.
00:38:28 And this applies whether or not you are currently running ads or never run ads. We'll do both all of this for you, basically under the Google ads blueprint. Perfect. Awesome. How do we find it? I'll send you a link and maybe you can drop it into the show notes.com/jean. Oh, that's easy. Yes. basically.com forward slash Jamie. And we'll put it in the show notes.
00:38:52 Perfect. Awesome. Reuben, thanks for your time and your insights. And I can't wait to have you back on again. Thank you For listening to today's episode. If you liked what you heard, tell a friend, hit that subscribe button and leave us a rating and review. It makes a huge difference in helping others. Like you find us. If you'd like to learn more about our education and coaching programs,
00:39:20 head over to Everything. Coworking dot com. We'll see you next week.
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