134. Jamie Orr on why she Created a new Space Management App

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134. Jamie Orr on why she Created a new Space Management App

00:00:01 Welcome to the everything Coworking podcast, where you learn what you need to know about how the world wants to work. And now your host, co working space owner and trend expert Jamie Russo. Welcome to the everything Coworking podcast. This is Jamie Russo. Thank you for joining me. I am thrilled to have a repeat special guest on the show today with some exciting updates. I give her a full intro as we get rolling, so I'm not going to do double duty here Will keep things moving If you have not yet gotten on the Notify me list,

00:00:41 I am going to re launch or open some spots for additional community managers to join Community Manager University in the next month or so. If you are interested, you can go to www dot everything coworking dot com forward slash community managers. There's a link in the show notes as well. We had a full new cohort join in December, and I am really enjoying getting to know everyone supporting the group and continuing to develop content and training that helps them do their jobs. So the platform includes many courses that cover the major buckets of the community manager role,

00:01:21 including community management operations, marketing, finance, leadership and I've laid out the contents in a graduated learning path so that the community manager can identify what content is relevant to them. Given their experience, they also get monthly in depth training's Q and A call and a slack group. And we've had a really active slack group in great participation in the Q and A Calls. And the group ranges from haven't opened yet to have been open for a while and just looking for additional supporting the learning opportunities and the ability to connect with others that are in their same role.

00:01:55 So it is going super well so far again if you want to get notified. Www dot everything coworking dot com Ford slash community managers And without further ado, let's get into our conversation for today. Thank you for joining me today. I am here with a previous guest. I don't duplicate many guests unless they have some exciting content to share. I'm thrilled to have with me again today co founder of co work Tahoe and a big update co founder of Jelly Switch, which is a fairly new Coworking software management platform.

00:02:31 So We're gonna talk about some updates to her co working space and talk about her new software platform jelly switch. Jamie or thank you for joining me today. And he's so much for having me back. We didn't cover in our preach at I'm coming thio the north side of the lake this weekend. It's snowing, yet it is snowing right now. Oh, good. Good news. It's been sprinkling here. So what does that mean? I've been like heads down today, so I don't have a chance to check the weather.

00:02:58 But good news means more shoveling, but better snow on the mountains. I'm excited to get other and see you later this week. Yeah, Good. So thanks for coming back. We're just saying I think we talked. End of 2018. So it's been a while. I would love to hear you have a co working space in South Lake Tahoe. Tell us updates. How is that going? What's new? Since we last chatted. Eso no color. Tahoe was founded in 2014. So we're actually creeping up on our six year anniversary in South Lake Tahoe.

00:03:32 What is that in the space here and now, or including the original space, including the two years in our original little quiet point. Perfectly art in 1200 we will be at four years in our new building. Last year we actually ended up completing an expansion onto that existing building. He killed 1100 square feet of additional office space because our wait list got to the point or private offices that we were even people on it for too long. Yeah, and so we looked at our parcel and we looked at if we'd be able to build in.

00:04:08 Building in Tahoe is actually very, very tricky. So I thought I was like, Wow, that that was probably a minor feat. It was just the planning process alone was about a year and 1/2 full of getting all of the plan submitted and approved. But we were able to max out our parcel and add on six beautiful new, larger private office, and we have, and then one more a small kind of like phoned with meeting room as well, and we call it the West Wing. Not fun.

00:04:37 We're still adding some decorations, but it was fully leased out before we even about the paint on the walls. Beautiful. That's a lovely experience to have. I can't six years. Would you say that's flown by? It really has flown by. And the only reason I can tell it's the size of my Children. Get right. I know that's funny. You have My daughter was like, 10 weeks old when I did my install for my space in Chicago, and he has no eight yet. People ask me all the time about length of release,

00:05:08 and I think this. We've talked about this before. But people tend to want to go into smaller spaces, shorter term leases, And I'm like, you have no idea how fast time will fly and the things that you'll want to get done in the space, including, like, what? You've done an expansion. So six years will. Five years is not enough, you know. Can you imagine having been done last year like having to look for new space? Or do we negotiate? I am so thankful that we took the leap on Gwent process and so that we on the building ourselves so that we really do have full control over our lot,

00:05:40 which is like a nice little city block. Yeah, It's been great from that perspective, but it was terrifying to do it. Yeah, it is paying off for sure. Yeah, Good. Okay, so and then, in addition to expanding this base, we and having another actual human child in those six years to write, you decided you would launch a software company. So tell us about that. You know, what was the trigger? Sort of. What got you, like, sort of scratching your head at night,

00:06:10 thinking maybe I should do this. Well, you know, we spent so much time on the physical space itself making sure that the renovation of the original newspaper building was done really well and that, you know, perfect ing out the right furniture and building out the spaces so that as people interact with the space, they had a certain experience. And going through that process realized that there was a big missing piece, and that was technology really supporting the member experience that I was looking for. And, you know,

00:06:40 we tried several products and there's a lot of really amazing offer products out there. There's a lot to choose from, but I just wasn't finding it and we actually had a member in the space. That was another Silicon Valley expats. And you know, he and I got to talking and decided Thio, go ahead and try to build out that vision for this really amazing member experience that matched the physical experience our taco members were expecting. And so that was kind of the genesis of really sweet. So is he your engineers year CTO R?

00:07:13 How does he fit into your remember? Yes, sir, He is in a software engineer. He was with Venture back to start. Oppa's a cofounder for many years in San Francisco. The great experience. Really amazing engineering skills and said he was playing the role of both CEO and CTO. Okay, Great. And he was a member. I love those stories too. I hear them every so often, like member investors members getting involved.

00:07:39 I mean, this is a great one we ever know. He showed up at my doorstep, which,

00:07:43 when trying to find a technical co founder huge, It's huge, right? Especially if you're with the population of South Lake.

00:07:51 11,000 people a working about closer to 30 about Oh, you're 30,000 you big And I thought that's why you get the whole foods.

00:07:59 I think Turkey's probably the leftist that listened way. You have the whole booth radio Not far from our space.

00:08:06 A lot of members. Yeah. Okay, so you decide to create this. What are some of the things?

00:08:13 What was part of your vision that you've started to realize in the product? Like, what are some of the things that were exciting to you and you were passionate about providing to co working space operators?

00:08:24 Well, so one of the things was this idea that, you know, I'm literally running around all day.

00:08:30 You know, I don't sit at the front desk. I don't have reception. A lot of times.

00:08:33 Frankly, I am on mountain skiing. And so we've done a number of times. We've actually returned phone calls or interacted with people while we're on a ski lift.

00:08:44 You know, that kind of level of flexibility is really hard to get with a laptop in front of you.

00:08:49 And so one of the key things that jealous, which is doing is completely mobile. First Mobile against is not in addition,

00:08:57 it's not an ad on its or of the platform. So is the mobile. First both for the member and the operator,

00:09:04 like front and in back end. Yep, so both member facing and operator facing You know everything's available in a Web browser as well.

00:09:12 Because sometimes I do want to take you no longer perform notes, or do you have anything larger graphs and with on my own screen?

00:09:19 But for both members and operators, they're interacting that way, even for members. You know they're walking.

00:09:25 We've got a one storey building that's when you're walking, you know, to and from like the lobby to the co working area eating rooms.

00:09:33 It's really nice that you can have everything with you as you're going. You could make like a meeting room reservation as you're working on the hallway.

00:09:44 That was huge for us to be able to provide that extra level of flexibility. Awesome. So in terms of we talked a little bit in our pre chat about some of the other really unique features.

00:09:58 And if I've skipped kind of A. So we got the mobile first. Well, actually, before we dive into their really unique features,

00:10:04 talk a little bit. What are some of the other kind of member serving features that you've built in that you know you've seen are important in your space and that people are getting excited about as they start to use your product.

00:10:18 You're one of the other things that we were looking at was the relationship between members and the space that they work from and how they interact with that brand.

00:10:28 And so part of the mobile experience is also a completely custom branded mobile app. So for Cork Tahoe,

00:10:34 it is a coworker tile app in both the IOS and Android stores. So that, you know, every single thing that our members are doing and experiencing is interacting with that friend and helping build that brand loyalty.

00:10:49 And, you know, they don't necessarily. You know, most people don't know kind of the service providers on the back end.

00:10:54 Well, operators D'oh! And so, you know, they don't know, right? The difference in DC and yeah,

00:10:59 you know it and nor do they need Thio. And so it was really important for us to have that be really,

00:11:05 really forward facing. And then it's things like, you know, what do you members need to do on a day to day basis in order to not have to make them do more work but things like,

00:11:17 you know, getting in the door. And so we actually integrate with all the major door providers. We decided at this time that hardware was not something we wanted to focus on yet.

00:11:25 But, you know, maybe in the future we will need to be able to book meeting room's really quickly and so you can make room reservations again on your mobile phone when you're drinking coffee in the morning,

00:11:35 where as you're walking down the hallway, notifying staff members and getting feedback to us if something's wrong and you don't see me across the room or where I am normally you know,

00:11:45 and share on the way out on the ski lift her fate like that yeah, they consider, let me know like havens means attention.

00:11:50 Also, we really encourage, Remember, stall to give us positive feedback Earth. If they want different snacks or different amenities,

00:11:57 they have a really easy way to provide that share that so, I mean, is your adoption essentially 100% on the APP?

00:12:05 Because they at least have to use it for door access, I assume. Do you have any other way to get in,

00:12:11 Okay? And you know, for spaces that don't necessarily Elektronik Praxis reaction, you still seem really high engagement Now.

00:12:17 We also have every, like, all the events that are going on in the States, that they have an events platform that they can engage with and see what's going on.

00:12:25 I actually list other events for Court Tahoe. That air of just my members. We have a lot of members that are new to town.

00:12:32 Yeah, I want to get involved. Yeah, so we have to be involved. And so again,

00:12:36 that's another engagement east the room reservations. They're all for the app and then all the membership in billing and payments so you can see everything right in the app.

00:12:44 Everything's great. Yeah, That means I can see everything in the app, all of the data in one place.

00:12:50 And so I'm really learning new things about how my members interact with my company and my space and what they need,

00:12:56 and I could make some. I'm starting to really get into a lot of the data stuff and having fun,

00:13:00 looking at ways I can then use that to further improvement number experience. Yeah, What about Member to Member?

00:13:07 Communicate? And I've seen a demo, and I apologize. It's been a little bit so I'm asking lots of questions,

00:13:13 but can they communicate with each other or member directory? Not yet. You know, we're being really conscientious about the things that we add in you.

00:13:21 Do you want to make sure that any time we add something to the product that there will still be really high engagement?

00:13:26 Because the worst thing you could have, like, a member of chat room where nobody have nobody's there?

00:13:30 Yep. Right. So, you know, as we see, like, what space is you and you talked to more operators and also testing about your Tahoe will start to fold in more of that.

00:13:41 You know, we are looking at building out more of, like a marketplace directory. So if someone needs a website designer and you know those types of things,

00:13:49 Yeah, type of interaction, I think we'll have much more engagement than a very fraud. And open our Yep.

00:13:55 Totally. Yeah, I love that. I know. Are members air constantly asking for referrals and we don't actually have that ability is so way.

00:14:03 Do it manually. No. Which is also a great opportunity for community manager, but still, but the right?

00:14:10 Yeah. And I was in to say, I know a lot of spaces you slack and have varying success levels in terms of getting people to use it.

00:14:17 And so from you to your point about notifying staff members if you know something needs to be taken care of,

00:14:23 like you can have that confidence that people have an easy way to do it. And it's a platform that they actually use versus worrying that their people running around in space who don't use black.

00:14:32 And I don't see you with the front desk and, you know, have something they need and that kind of thing.

00:14:36 So, yeah, the utilization is a huge plus there. Totally. So we talked a little bit about some of the unique features that are on the coming soon list,

00:14:45 but you've been doing a lot of research around how to support child care models. Tell me about their tell us our luckily you know,

00:14:53 it's been great to see so much coverage on you when you were interviewed for agreed article about working with in child care together and it is a niche.

00:15:02 But it's one that does seem to be catching momentum. And I think we're you know, we are assuring to see as more work spaces and especially flexible work spaces start trying to attract and really serve this distributed workforce.

00:15:15 And, you know, a lot of millennials that are now parents know it does seem to be be growing and talking with a lot of operators,

00:15:23 especially in groups like yours, as well as like the women who core group. No, it's not a very well served Mitch because the child care model layered on with co working at so much more complex it.

00:15:36 Yeah, mainly in so many ways. But get up originally. Yeah, yeah, Things uh, you've been looking at is,

00:15:44 you know, if you are really trying to prioritize the member experience and especially member experiences, actually, you're around.

00:15:51 A lot of these more independent working cases that's offering a way to handle child care bookings as well could really do the industry a lot of good.

00:16:02 And so it's something that we committed to do and that we're going to launch as a result of that,

00:16:05 even if it is a small, earning straight now. Yeah, I love that. You think there are probably a lot of operators and soon to be.

00:16:12 I mean, I think there that's right. A growing segment to your point, which I'm sure it's part of,

00:16:17 You know, your decision on kind of who to serve and who to support. But yeah, I'd love that unique step on it.

00:16:24 I mean, I'm a mom of right myself, and so you know it. Certainly there's a bit of a personal touch in there as well.

00:16:30 But I do think that Justin again in terms of being true to why we started this project in the first place,

00:16:36 that it will be a really nice additions. Yeah, Who would you say? Is there a specific kind of operator besides your unique niche in the child care that's coming soon and definitely keep us up to date on that?

00:16:49 Definitely jump into the Facebook group when that's live and let us know. But do you have sort of,

00:16:55 ah, you know, an operator that the best fit for jelly switch? Or can anyone who's starting a space should be kind of doing the rounds on the demos and checking it out.

00:17:04 I mean, I think you know, obviously I would like to think that we're we're well suited to any kind of working.

00:17:09 You're flexible office space. You know, it is definitely we're focusing right now on more of the independent coworking spaces in accordance.

00:17:17 These operators, One thing that I personally, really enjoy doing is working with new operators. So anyone that is just starting Thio open their space and starting to set up their operational systems to really jump in and used jelly Switch as a way to also learn kind of best operating procedures and some of the best practices in the industry.

00:17:40 And that's one of the things that I'm trying to help bring to the company is my experience and expertise in that area and having talked Thio,

00:17:46 you know, just hundreds and hundreds operators at this point after six years. But, you know, I do think that we're gonna be starting to grow up stream and you know,

00:17:54 hopefully, as our customers grow will be ableto help them do that really get more members getting remember retention really drive up the profitability of spaces so that they can grow in scale in whatever way they want thio on,

00:18:10 then, you know, as they grow weak and to grow with Yeah, I mean, I think,

00:18:14 you know, you talked about sort of growing the platform based on member experience and how to serve that.

00:18:19 I think that member experiences is really, I mean, where it's at. We're just talking to some operators like the Dallas market,

00:18:27 for example, is wild. So much competition and a lot of it on pricing. And that's hard,

00:18:35 right? And you can't eliminate all pricing, you know, discussion and considerations. But if you have better technology,

00:18:43 better staff, better experience, better community, like you gotta be operating on all cylinders in order for that,

00:18:49 you know, to try to compete against price worse in tight markets. Not that every market is gonna be like a Dallas,

00:18:55 you know, But I'm a firm believer, especially when it comes to praising. You know, one of the things that we get asked a lot for sponsorships and for free day passes and free trials and co work Tahoe.

00:19:05 And it's actually something I'm really that you know, I very rarely will give away free day pass. And we have very tight restrictions on how we offer trade spaces or the other,

00:19:16 like nonprofit groups, like it has to be, oh, category of local nonprofit that need. And then,

00:19:22 you know we will work with people on that. And I do think that it's important any time you're pricing a product,

00:19:28 whether it's in co working or in any business, I think it's more important to focus on adding value than cutting costs.

00:19:35 Yeah, you can totally you can only far exactly. Yeah, yeah. And then you're really going as you cut costs more and more.

00:19:42 And as you go to the bottom of the barrel and you have nowhere to go, and if you're not a profitable space and you're not thriving,

00:19:50 you're also not gonna be able to provide that grade member experience that your members I think it's much more important to focus on having values.

00:19:57 Yeah, and I love the Do you talk about the app in your chores? I do. So any time I give a tour,

00:20:05 they actually have the app downloaded and they're signed up before we get back. Oh, part of my process.

00:20:11 And so or I gave just yesterday the potential member had signed up. They went home and I saw a push notification come through like maybe 20 minutes later that they bought a membership.

00:20:25 So I didn't even have time to send a follow up email. Wow! Coming in for a tour.

00:20:29 Do you have any questions? Note. They signed up my son from me on it. Cut that step out completely.

00:20:34 It's been amazing. And it's happened a lot since we started using the optic, which so you have them download.

00:20:40 What is the reason for having them download it? I mean, I know the marketing reason, but what do you give them?

00:20:46 That's the reason. So just so that I can actually show them out of a meeting room initially. Oh,

00:20:51 hey, see you like you're on your app is the ever obscure a meeting room and you could actually have them look through that and walk through with me and so they can do.

00:21:02 And also, if you are a non member, you can still sign up in R S V p for events that are happening in the space.

00:21:08 Time to use that excuse like, Hey, we have to be coming through. Do you want to go?

00:21:12 We'll download the APP. Birth, you pee in that way, we'll know you're Yeah, it's a real estate on someone's phone.

00:21:18 Yeah, no, it's great. I'm always curious about that. Tour experiences such a important part of the sales funnel,

00:21:24 and so any kind of strategies around getting people engaged in. But I love that because it's so visible,

00:21:31 like the benefit of the app that's custom branded is, and you get to actually walk them through it.

00:21:38 I mean, they can sort of see the tangible experience of what that would look like and not to overuse the word tangible.

00:21:45 But when you're walking through and talking about meeting rooms and what it's like to work in a co working space,

00:21:49 if they haven't, it's sort of like, Oh, they can visualize like, Oh, I can easily book And you know,

00:21:54 you're meeting rooms and this is what the experience is like. And I can use this to get in the space,

00:21:58 and it makes it more real. And yeah, that's great. Marketing tool. You know, the tour is all about again setting not only figuring out what they need,

00:22:07 but then really setting the expectation that you're speak, provide that and helping them sure themselves in your space.

00:22:13 And so having that mobile experience is part of the tour in I've got some really wild and crazy ideas of how we evolving Lake augmented reality stuff for some Matley cool maps or something.

00:22:25 But, you know, maybe we might need a couple rounds of funding before the dream list. Yeah,

00:22:31 I've got my dream list of what else we can do to really set those expectations for a premium member.

00:22:38 Or they go off and go home and try to make that again in competitive markets. I think doing things like that and having that in mind,

00:22:46 Yeah, if you have someone's app on your phone and you don't have that from other spaces, I mean,

00:22:50 it's in point. If everybody was using Jelly Switch, then everyone would have it. But it's still.

00:22:56 But even then, you just you have to sort of upper level your game as the technology changes. So I think that's an important consideration as well.

00:23:04 We'll process for all of us. Yeah, back to your point about folks kind of thinking about software.

00:23:10 That would be my tip toe listeners. If you're thinking about opening a space. I feel like the space management platform.

00:23:16 Right? People sometimes wait. It takes a while to set it up. But also, you can kind of reverse engineer your operating procedures because it helps you get a really good visual.

00:23:27 Or maybe mental map is a better way to put it of how a space operates and one of the things you need to consider.

00:23:34 And what are the other at on, you know, tools that you need. So, yeah, it's never too early to get a demo,

00:23:39 and to start thinking about that and making some choices and starting your own boarding process, would you say you don't have to have all the answers before you?

00:23:46 Yeah, it started on the way that we have structured. It is incredibly easy to end up a custom bread and mobile app for someone to start using before they even have members.

00:23:57 Yeah, really? Against start to see those things and make those decisions. And I always worry about co working spaces,

00:24:03 making their pricing models to complex. Well, if you've got a platform already in place, you can kind of see what everybody else is doing because it's built into into the platform and start making some of those choices and hopefully avoid some of the pitfalls that air really common one.

00:24:19 Starting your pricing is one of those is really complicated and really each miss the mark on. Yeah, we have a good guide.

00:24:28 That is, quite literally how you're then, gonna be charging members. That the great yeah, helps you back into it.

00:24:33 Yes. And I would say differently. Pricing should not become right. I know you and I were e mailing about unexamined all that had,

00:24:44 you know, 100 different variations. And it was overwhelming. Yeah. Can't give people too many choices,

00:24:50 huh? Overload is is a real thing and really can hurt sales. Yeah, so I would just love to hear,

00:24:56 baby. Also tell me if there's anything else about jelly switch that you want to share. I'd love the year since you're talking to so many operators like any kind of interesting,

00:25:04 like challenges that people are seeing that are popping up or, you know, any kind of insider view that might be interesting to share.

00:25:12 It's probably not a surprise, but you know, the mean being on operators minds is getting more members.

00:25:20 Yeah, you know, it's again. It's something that we're looking really deeply at is you know, how can we leverage the mobile platform toe help co working spaces at early engagements before people actually sign up in,

00:25:32 and also then look at the rest of their operations to see if you have if there's other things that they can do to provide value?

00:25:38 Oh, do you think having data in one place is gonna be a big benefit? A lot of coworking operators,

00:25:43 because the level of duct tape and obstacle sticks in our industry right now is was even bigger than I thought it was.

00:25:50 I know that my systems were all over the place before. Yeah, and it's really hard to then get an idea of,

00:25:57 you know, that 30,000 foot view of your business that is really important. Tohave. Yep, I think the appetite for getting that view's much higher in our industry as it's maturing,

00:26:08 which is really exciting to see, because I do think we're going to start seeing more and more best practices and kind of standard procedures that are gonna be good for everybody.

00:26:15 Yeah, absolutely. I know. Well, six years ago, things were just not the same. I know through the early days of software,

00:26:23 and it still is. I think, this software choice. It's kind of like co working. You know,

00:26:29 we still haven't gotten there are not options that fit everyone's needs. Yet you know, there's a level of look.

00:26:35 You can't make software for everyone's needs, but there's still room for evolution and new options in the marketplace.

00:26:42 I'm hoping we can use technology to help push the industry forward and be proactive in a really positive way.

00:26:49 So it's not just reactively developing or all of those needs. And, you know, again, hopefully that will be a positive contributions.

00:26:57 I'm certainly I'd love it. This is the best job I've ever had. Yeah, this is way better than what I used to dio.

00:27:05 Yeah, we remind to see. So I know you're general background. But for anybody who hasn't listened to your podcast,

00:27:11 which is a ways back now, remind us of your original background. We should destroy it with that.

00:27:15 My original background is I'm a PhD with theoretical physics. And so I spent a lot of time in basement laboratories on giant microscopes,

00:27:23 looking at that. Really, really, really tiny nano structures. So I enjoy the co working world much more,

00:27:31 isn't it? I mean, you never would have imagined I would guess. Are you an introvert? I am a total introvert.

00:27:38 Okay, But you find the balance like when you need a little space, you go find the ski lift with your mobile app.

00:27:44 And I did a lot of teaching. And so I think you know that side of it. I still get to teach and to help.

00:27:52 And that's the part of the industry that I really enjoy. And it's so collaborative and so helpful. Yeah,

00:27:57 it's I know I'm trying to focus more on, you know, gratitude for the journey. And, you know,

00:28:02 as entrepreneurs were always like, what? Want to get to that step ahead. And when I'm taking those moments,

00:28:08 I just think the same things. The people are great, the collaboration is great. So I'm just fortunate place.

00:28:14 We have landed. So, speaking of education, you've been writing a lot and doing videos, and you have a lot of expertise as an operator that's now been doing this for a while and your exposure.

00:28:25 I love that about my role is it sounds like, you know, as a teacher in particular, you're really enjoying that exposure to what other operators are thinking and what's keeping them up at night.

00:28:34 But where can we follow you? Thio? Get exposure to your wisdom and the things that you're sharing?

00:28:40 Yes, I do have a YouTube channels. You can look up really sweet on you. You think I've got about a dozen videos up there so far,

00:28:46 and I'm trying to add more and more every week. And then I also have our bloggers on our newly minted website.

00:28:52 So jelly switch dot com slash blob. And then I'm trying to get more and more active on Twitter,

00:28:56 and you can find me in all of the Facebook. Well, if anybody's ever wanting to ping me,

00:29:01 can just you can hunt me down somewhere. Awesome. I will put those links in the show notes as well.

00:29:07 Jamie, Thanks for the update. Sanka work Tahoe and for sharing what you're up to with jelly Switch,

00:29:12 I look forward to more updates. Like I said, make sure you jump into our Facebook group and keep us posted,

00:29:17 especially on the childcare features it's really exciting. Well, yes, thank you so much for having me.

00:29:22 It's always fun. Thanks for joining us on this episode of everything co working. Be sure to click the subscribe button so you can stay up to date on the latest trends and how to until next time.

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Jamie Russo